Guru Dutt To Waheeda: 'You Don't Look Like A Woman...'

'You have become a big star. How can you play a secondary role to Meena Kumari?'

Celebrating Guru Dutt's birth centenary on July 9 with this must-read excerpt from the book, Kagaz Ke Phool and Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam: The Original Screenplay by Dinesh Raheja and J Kothari.

• Part 1 of the Interview: 'Guru Dutt Was Very Down To Earth'

In the concluding segment of this interview with movie legend Waheeda Rehman, she looks back at her association with Guru Dutt and says, "He had started becoming a little confused towards the end."

By the year 1962, you had featured in several successful films. Did you have any qualms about playing a secondary role to Meena Kumari in Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam?

The moment I read the novel, I was clear that I wanted to play Chhoti Bahu, the Bibi.

When Guru Dutt refused, I asked, 'Am I not a good actress?' He pointed out: 'You don't look like a woman. You look like a girl.'

Since I was adamant and pleaded with them, Guru Duttji and (cinematographer V K) Murthy made me do a photo-session in which I was dressed up as Chhoti Bahu in a Bengali sari and with a round tika on the forehead.

When Murthy looked at the final prints, he expressed his reservations: 'Waheeda, Guru theek keh raha hai. Tum bachcha lagte ho (Guru is right. You look like a child).'

I relented.

Subsequently, Guru Duttji entrusted the film's direction to Abrar Alvi. One day, I got a call from Abrarsaab and he wanted me to play Jaba. I responded, 'Fine, that's also an interesting character.'

Guru Duttji thought I had gone crazy. He soundly ticked me off on the phone.

He said, 'You have become a big star. How can you play a secondary role to Meena Kumari?'

I told him I was fine by it. I never had any hang-ups about playing a secondary role.

How do you rate Meena Kumari's performance in the film?

She was superb. Meenaji looked ethereal in Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam. In my opinion, she didn't look as good in any other film, not even in Pakeezah.

I think Guru Duttji rightly convinced me that I wasn't the apt choice for Bibi's role.

I wasn't old enough to play Chhoti Bahu; I wouldn't have looked the part.

Abrar Alvi is credited with directing Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam . What was Guru Dutt's contribution to the film?

Initially, Guru Duttji would not come on the sets often. I remember when I saw the rushes of the song, Bhanwra Bada Naadan Hai, I wasn't happy.

Neither was Murthy.

Both of us trooped to Guru Duttji. After he saw the song, he reshot it; and the song was transformed.

He infused life into Bhanwra Bada Naadan Hai.

Like Raj Kapoor, Raj Khosla and Goldie (Vijay Anand), Guru Duttji too was excellent at song picturisations.

Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam was your last film with the Guru Dutt banner and thereafter you went separate ways.

I worked on a salary for Guru Dutt Films right up to Sahib Biwi Aur Ghulam. I never spoke about raising my remuneration.

The salary was hiked every year as predetermined. But Guru Duttji was a very understanding and humane.

I was doing lots of films with other filmmakers.

Guru Duttji had once told me, 'Actresses have a limited professional lifespan. This is your chance to make money. Do as you wish but do good work.'

Was there any talk of resuming Raaz, which had been abandoned?

He had started becoming a little confused towards the end. I think he was suffering from depression.

His sister, the artist Lalitha Lajmi, pointed out that he would begin a film and then stop.

Raaz was started twice and abandoned both times. When we asked him for a reason, he replied, 'I am not happy.'

He was making a Bengali film with Geeta Dutt, but he stopped that twice too.

Something was happening to him.

In Guru Dutt's last three productions -- Kaagaz Ke Phool, Chaudhvin Ka Chand and Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam -- a central character dies. Do you think his latter films reflect a somewhat morbid obsession with death?

I was in Chennai with several other artistes for a charity cricket match when the actress Shammi called me to a corner.

Puzzled, I complied.

She told me that Guru Duttji had passed away. I exclaimed, 'Oh my God!'

After a pause, 'Yeh toh hona hi tha (This was bound to happen)' slipped out of my mouth.

She asked, 'Why do you say that?'

I replied that he had tried something similar many times earlier.

Guru Duttji witnessed the failure of Kaagaz Ke Phool and the subsequent success of Chaudhvin Ka Chand.

One day, he pondered aloud, 'What does life have to offer? Success and failure. I have seen both, now what is the point of carrying on?'

He said this on the sets and we all countered him very vigorously.

I said, 'This is a selfish attitude.'

He was intrigued and asked why I had qualified it as selfish.

I reminded him, 'So many people are earning their livelihood because of you. You have given opportunity to talents like Johnny Walker. You brought Rehman saab back to films as a character actor. We are all here for you. Why be unhappy? If you are upset, it's not fair that you just sit and be sad.'

Do you think creative people have a responsibility to their talent?

Yes. I am a very practical person.

I told him, 'This attitude is wrong. Keep making films. Think of it as charity.'

He was fascinated by this line of thinking but...

Kind courtesy: Kagaz Ke Phool and Sahib Bibi Aur Ghulam: The Original Screenplay by Dinesh Raheja and J Kothari. Published by Om Books International in association with Vinod Chopra Films

Photographs curated by Satish Bodas/Rediff