'Salman Has A Really Soft Corner For His Dad'

'Salman wanted to do the interview properly. That's why he was nervous, you know, that dad should be happy.'

"I had two ways of looking at Angry Young Men: Either make it a Masterclass in scriptwriting or tell the story of Salim-Javed. I chose the latter," says Namrata Rao.

The biographical docu-series looks into the lives of Bollywood's famous writers Salim Khan and Javed Akhtar, the men who wrote 24 films, out of which 22 were big hits.

They were the ones responsible for making Amitabh Bachchan a star.

They were the ones who wrote the cult classic Sholay, whose dialogues are repeated till today by a generation who wasn't even born when the film released in 1975.

It's a huge pressure and Rao, 44, did feel it.

"I think the bigger pressure on my head was, who watches documentaries? We're not a culture where people love to go and see documentaries in their free time. I felt that pressure more. And when it came closer to the release and I started talking to people, giving interviews, the pressure returned," Namrata Rao tells Ronjita Kulkarni/Rediff.com in a must-read conversation.

What kind of reactions are you getting from Angry Young Men?

It's been great. It has cut across ages.

People, who did not watch documentaries, are watching it, so that feels very gratifying.

While doing it, I wanted younger people to watch it and get introduced to Salim-Javed's work and the films of those times.

What did Salim-Javed have to say about the docu-series?

They enjoyed it thoroughly.

They watched it just a day or two before it released, with their friends and family, and were quite moved.

Of course, they said a few things that we could have added this or that.

Like what?

They were asking me why I chose not to keep the part after they had split. But that was a conscious decision.

There were a lot of moments, where we simply get to watch Salimsaab and Javedsaab, even when they are not talking. Like when they are pouring a cup of tea. How many hours did you shoot them?

With each of them, I shot around seven times. Or maybe eight.

I shot the series over three years.

We started in March 2021 and the shooting started in June 2021. We shot till March this year.

How many hours of footage did you have?

We shot with other people as well. Then, there was so much archive of old footage and photographs.

I think there was close to 600 hours of footage.

How did you bag Angry Young Men?

I worked on this anthology called Lust Stories (2018) with Zoya Akhtar.

While we were working on it, we would chat about films, documentaries and film-makers... In one of those conversations, Zoya had told me that she always wanted to make this documentary on Salim-Javed and she wanted to call it Angry Young Men.

I was really taken by it even then.

In December 2020, she asked me if I would direct it and I said yes immediately.

Were Salim-Javed ever apprehensive about a series on their lives?

Zoya and Alvira (Agnihotri Khan) spoke to their respective dads and got them on board.

I've heard Zoya say in interviews that both of them had their apprehensions at first.

You have interviewed Salimsaab and Javedsaab separately in the series. Why didn't you talk to them together?

When we started shooting, we were in the peak of the pandemic, so it was not possible.

The shoot alone was a big problem because of the distancing and masks and all that.

Then, a couple of logistical issues happened when we decided to shoot Salim first and then Javed. Something or the other kept happening and eventually, we shot them together in Diwali 2023.

Raj Thackeray had invited them to inaugurate the lighting of Shivaji Park in October or November 2023.

The photoshoot that you see in the series happened at his home.

What was that reunion like? They must have met after years.

They were chill together.

Like the moment when Javedsaab walks in and they hug each other and just sit down.

There was no ice breaking required because they knew this documentary was happening. Every time I would go to meet Javedsaab, I would tell him what all I've shot with Salimsaab, and vice versa.

They knew this was happening and that they would meet.

They were joking and making fun.

After that, they've met many times during the trailer launch etc, and it's been very easy whenever they meet. Just like old times.

In the series, Salman Khan says this is the first interview he has done where he is actually nervous.

I met him before the shoot and told him the essence of it, how I would like him to participate and he was very sporting. I was very happy after that interview.

He is the oldest of the siblings and the one who has seen Salim-Javed working together the most.

He is also the one who was present when the split happened. Everyone else was much younger.

He has a really soft corner for his dad and wanted to do it properly. That's why he was nervous, you know, that dad should be happy.

Why were Salim Khan's children Sohail Khan and Alvira Agnihotri not part of it?

Because of logistical reasons.

We wanted to do it but something or the other would come up, like they were travelling or weren't around.

Amitabh Bachchan was the one who really benefitted from Salim-Javed's partnership but he doesn't say much in the series.

Amitabh's bit was done virtually, I hadn't done the interview. I wish I did, I would have pushed him to say more.

The series does't detail the reasons for the Salim-Javed split.

You have to pick and choose, so I thought I'll stick with the story of Salim and Javed.

There are so many things that they did later but I didn't think that would have been the right end for this story.

But like they said (in the series), the films weren't working (after a point).

There are claims that Javed Akhtar took to the bottle, and that was a reason for the split as well.

Javedsaab did talk about his alcoholism, and that was in the edits for a long time.

But I decided not to go into their life post their breakup.

 

Their last film was Mr India, which released in 1987, several years after the split. Why didn't you include such an important film?

Then why not Zamana (the 1985 film starring Rajesh Khanna, Rishi Kapoor, Poonam Dhillon and Ranjeeta) as well?

They were not actively working together on those, so I thought that was a whole different ball game.

It didn't feel like the natural choice.

The last film they wrote together was Shakti, which is one of my favourite films. We had done a lot of in-depth analysis and spoken to a lot of people for that film. But I felt it was not so engaging to go into one film analysis after another, so I decided to leave it out.

Who were the film folk you really wanted to speak to, dead or alive?

I wanted to speak to all the directors who worked with Salim and Javed. And most of them were no more, like Yashji (Chopra), Manmohan Desai, Prakash Mehra... Ravi Tandon actually passed away in the middle of our shoot.

Why didn't you speak to Gulzar, who was their contemporary?

I really wanted to shoot with Gulzarsaab.

Initially, because of COVID, it didn't happen and then there were some logistical reasons like the timing. When we were shooting, he was not available.

It's my loss.

You have covered Sholay extensively in the series but it's a cult movie that everyone knows everything about. How difficult was it to bring something new to the table?

While making it, I was not thinking about the film buffs or people who know everything about every movie.

I was thinking more about somebody like my parents who are not very filmi, who watch a film here and there, who are not really into trivia...

I was also thinking about a younger audience.

Sholay is something everybody relates to, everybody connects with, so it was something I thought can pull them in.

And this was not supposed to be a Masterclass in screenplay writing. Neither was it supposed to be a detailed film analysis of all the films they've written. It was a story about their lives and that's what I wanted to stick to.

I was not coming from a place that, okay, I want to tell people hidden trivia and information about films. It was about their lives, and these are choices you make as a director.

How challenging was it to offer something new and engaging? That was honestly the biggest challenge for me and because I know that so much has been said about them, so many interviews have been given by them and honestly, if you Google any of these films, you can find hazaar information. I wanted to stick to them as people.

Who are they as people? That was my lens.

Did you ever feel the pressure of making a series on such cult writers, who entire generations have grown up on?

Of course, there was pressure.

There was this thing of how do you condense the story, which is so huge and so big. So I made my choices about the things I wanted to keep and the things I wanted to leave out.

As a film-maker, that pressure is always there, so I took it day by day.

I went on shoot.

I got the material.

I went through it.

I sat with my editor, and we worked on it together.

You don't think about the pressure on a daily basis.

I think the bigger pressure on my head was, who watches documentaries? We're not a culture where people love to go and see documentaries in their free time. I felt that pressure more.

And when it came closer to the release and I started talking to people, giving interviews, the pressure returned.

What was your favourite part in the series?

There's this whole section where they talk about how they both lost their mothers at a very young age, how that affected them, and somehow spilt over into their storytelling.

It kind of created this whole angry young man phenomenon because both had lost their mothers and were not close to their fathers.

How much did Salim-Javed influence you in your early years?

I had watched these films as a kid on Doordarshan many times over without really knowing that who wrote them.

Those days, I didn't have access to theatres, as my family was not into film watching.

The films I grew up on were Seeta Aur Geeta, Sholay... and these were the films that made me want to watch more films.

When I went to film school, that's when I figured out that these guys had written these films. But even then, I didn't know so much detail. That happened when I started researching on them.

Like I knew Kaala Patthar, but didn't know the details of what all went into making it, writing it, all those things.

What inputs did Zoya and Farhan give you?

Zoya was not involved in the shoot or edit as such but I would show her the cuts.

When I showed her the first cut of the first episode, we discussed that maybe we need a context for the Angry Young Man. That is when I thought of putting the whole segment about the films made in the '30s, '40s and '60s and how they were different then and then, in the '70s, when The Angry Young Man came, it was different.

So that suggestion came from her.

Reema Kagti suggested that in the second episode, the story of Sholay was a bit linear when I had first done it.

Her suggestion was that why don't we start with the failure of Sholay.

With Farhan, he told me that maybe, we should have something before Amitabh Bachchan speaks for the first time.

So we put a Zanjeer scene before that, where he comes to Teja and says, 'Teja, main aa gaya hoon aur main peeche se vaar nahin karta hoon'... that scene from Zanjeer in the restaurant.

I thought it really worked well because it cuts from Bachchan to Bachchan.

They never really told me, do this or don't do this because they were busy with their own projects.

Reema was doing Superboys Of Malegaon, Zoya was doing Made in Heaven and then Archies, and so was Farhan.

So it was not like they were there on a day-to-day basis.

What's been your biggest takeaway?

Their ability to dream big.

I'm not from the industry; I didn't know anyone in the film business at all.

So for me, it was really inspiring to see how they dreamed and made it happen.

And never to give up.

Like Javedsaab says, you have to keep at it, keep at it, go through the humiliations and still keep at it and suddenly a clearing will appear.

How did you become an editor?

I'm a Konkani from Kerala, my parents are still in Cochin. But I grew up in Delhi because my father was working there.

I went to the Satyajit Ray Film and Television Institute in Kolkata where I did a three-year course in film editing.

While studying there, I worked on three-four documentaries. One of them was, I Am The Very Beautiful, which travelled to quite a few film festivals.

Dibakar Banerjee saw it and really liked it. We connected and that's how I got my first feature film, Oye Lucky Lucky Oye, in 2008.

One thing led to another and I worked on his next film, Love Sex Aur Dhoka, where I also had a small acting role.

Then I got Ishqiya, Band Baajaa Baaraat, Kahaani, Shanghai, Jab Tak Hai Jaan, 2 States, Dum Laga Ke Haisha, about 35 films.

You started your career in 2008. Why didn't you direct earlier?

I've been trying, you know. I've been writing scripts, pitching them but everything has timing.

And this timing can happen to anyone.

Sometimes you can make a really good first film and then struggle to put your second film together.

It's not that if you are from a film family, you will have it easy.

What really works is success. If you are successful, people want to work with you.

I have seen so many people struggle, it's unbelievable.

Even in my career, there was a time when there was a lull, when I didn't do much editing work.

These are the ups and downs of the film business.

Zoya tells me how difficult it was to cast for her first film, Luck By Chance. It took her seven years to finally make the film. It should have been very easy for her but it wasn't.